Nsg applicant town hall

[neuron777]

Whether maintaining rotations for students who would have been able vs. the current decision of cancelling all rotations, someone would have been adversely impacted. There is no perfect answer when an entire country shelters in place. This is a broad stroke measure (esp. the general surgery decision which potentially negates a more valuable nsg letter); however, I think the turnaround time in responding to aways has been more organized and timely than many other specialties.

The panelists stated there will be other Zoom lectures in later months to adjust in real time. As a courtesy to people applying this cycle, its probably inappropriate in the future for M1s and M2s to ask questions about research/grades/step 1 during a presentation geared toward M4s trying to match in a pandemic cycle. Read the room people!

[Guest]

(05-01-2020, 12:46 AM)Guest Wrote: On the contrary, I think the gen surg requirement is probably the most equalizing mechanism out of anything they had proposed. An earlier poster said it nicely, it's the non-neurosurgeons that are often the most perceptive about your abilities. With the exception of letters from research mentors, everyone knows that most neurosurgery LORs are generic 2-3 sentences of BS. Nice to see the PDs separating the students that genuinely cared about the time they spent on the wards vs those that acted their singular goal in life was neurosurgery and shrugged off every other rotation

^This would be true if you get the letter right after finishing the rotation. 

I think if you can produce 4 nsgy letters, do it (not that this is easy to do). I think the gen surg letter is there for folks who may not have the ability to get that many nsgy/research mentor letters. Imagine being a year+ out from working with an attending who will hardly remember specifics.. it will be a general/lukewarm letter at best. This basically forces our hand to do a gen surg rotation now before eras to get a quality letter...

[Guest]

(05-01-2020, 12:56 AM)neuron777 Wrote: The panelists stated there will be other Zoom lectures in later months to adjust in real time. As a courtesy to people applying this cycle, its probably inappropriate in the future for M1s and M2s to ask questions about research/grades/step 1 during a presentation geared toward M4s trying to match in a pandemic cycle. Read the room people!

+1. Jfc ppl get it together. Makes me realize why the match rate is so low in this specialty

[Guest]

(05-01-2020, 12:57 AM)Guest Wrote:

(05-01-2020, 12:46 AM)Guest Wrote: On the contrary, I think the gen surg requirement is probably the most equalizing mechanism out of anything they had proposed. An earlier poster said it nicely, it's the non-neurosurgeons that are often the most perceptive about your abilities. With the exception of letters from research mentors, everyone knows that most neurosurgery LORs are generic 2-3 sentences of BS. Nice to see the PDs separating the students that genuinely cared about the time they spent on the wards vs those that acted their singular goal in life was neurosurgery and shrugged off every other rotation

^This would be true if you get the letter right after finishing the rotation. 

I think if you can produce 4 nsgy letters, do it (not that this is easy to do). I think the gen surg letter is there for folks who may not have the ability to get that many nsgy/research mentor letters. Imagine being a year+ out from working with an attending who will hardly remember specifics.. it will be a general/lukewarm letter at best. This basically forces our hand to do a gen surg rotation now before eras to get a quality letter...

Agree. I am not so sure about the theory Gen surg surgeons write better letter. My feedbacks from gen surg surgeons at my home programs were short and generic, and I know most of my other classmates experience similar. It really depends on the person who writes the letter.  Even to find a general surgery rotation to do right now prior to ERAS is not an easy task. 1. We don’t know if we will be back to clinical environment 2. General surgery spots during June to September are already taken by general surgery applicants. Some schools requires third year to make up the missed general surgery. So where do Neurosurgery applicant fit into this?

[Guest]

Did anyone get the Northwestern MS4 who matched at NYU’s email?

[Guest]

(05-01-2020, 01:08 AM)Guest Wrote:

(05-01-2020, 12:57 AM)Guest Wrote:

(05-01-2020, 12:46 AM)Guest Wrote: On the contrary, I think the gen surg requirement is probably the most equalizing mechanism out of anything they had proposed. An earlier poster said it nicely, it's the non-neurosurgeons that are often the most perceptive about your abilities. With the exception of letters from research mentors, everyone knows that most neurosurgery LORs are generic 2-3 sentences of BS. Nice to see the PDs separating the students that genuinely cared about the time they spent on the wards vs those that acted their singular goal in life was neurosurgery and shrugged off every other rotation

^This would be true if you get the letter right after finishing the rotation. 

I think if you can produce 4 nsgy letters, do it (not that this is easy to do). I think the gen surg letter is there for folks who may not have the ability to get that many nsgy/research mentor letters. Imagine being a year+ out from working with an attending who will hardly remember specifics.. it will be a general/lukewarm letter at best. This basically forces our hand to do a gen surg rotation now before eras to get a quality letter...

Agree. I am not so sure about the theory Gen surg surgeons write better letter. My feedbacks from gen surg surgeons at my home programs were short and generic, and I know most of my other classmates experience similar. It really depends on the person who writes the letter.  Even to find a general surgery rotation to do right now prior to ERAS is not an easy task. 1. We don’t know if we will be back to clinical environment 2. General surgery spots during June to September are already taken by general surgery applicants. Some schools requires third year to make up the missed general surgery. So where do Neurosurgery applicant fit into this?

yeah once my gen surg attendings found out I didnt want to do gen surg they basically ignored me

[Guest]

(05-01-2020, 01:55 AM)Guest Wrote:

(05-01-2020, 01:08 AM)Guest Wrote:

(05-01-2020, 12:57 AM)Guest Wrote:

(05-01-2020, 12:46 AM)Guest Wrote: On the contrary, I think the gen surg requirement is probably the most equalizing mechanism out of anything they had proposed. An earlier poster said it nicely, it's the non-neurosurgeons that are often the most perceptive about your abilities. With the exception of letters from research mentors, everyone knows that most neurosurgery LORs are generic 2-3 sentences of BS. Nice to see the PDs separating the students that genuinely cared about the time they spent on the wards vs those that acted their singular goal in life was neurosurgery and shrugged off every other rotation

^This would be true if you get the letter right after finishing the rotation. 

I think if you can produce 4 nsgy letters, do it (not that this is easy to do). I think the gen surg letter is there for folks who may not have the ability to get that many nsgy/research mentor letters. Imagine being a year+ out from working with an attending who will hardly remember specifics.. it will be a general/lukewarm letter at best. This basically forces our hand to do a gen surg rotation now before eras to get a quality letter...

Agree. I am not so sure about the theory Gen surg surgeons write better letter. My feedbacks from gen surg surgeons at my home programs were short and generic, and I know most of my other classmates experience similar. It really depends on the person who writes the letter.  Even to find a general surgery rotation to do right now prior to ERAS is not an easy task. 1. We don’t know if we will be back to clinical environment 2. General surgery spots during June to September are already taken by general surgery applicants. Some schools requires third year to make up the missed general surgery. So where do Neurosurgery applicant fit into this?

yeah once my gen surg attendings found out I didnt want to do gen surg they basically ignored me

Same...I don’t know how many will look past that and take their time to write a neurosurgery applicant a good letter

[Guest]

If I heard correctly, Dr. Selden said that they will be putting out a standardized template for LORs this cycle. 1) did I hear this correctly and 2) What are everyone's thoughts about this evolving after COVID towards SLOEs in neurosurgery like in EM?

[Guest]

(05-01-2020, 09:38 AM)Guest Wrote: If I heard correctly, Dr. Selden said that they will be putting out a standardized template for LORs this cycle. 1) did I hear this correctly and 2) What are everyone's thoughts about this evolving after COVID towards SLOEs in neurosurgery like in EM?

I think it's a good idea and will help extinguish the 2-3 sentence rec letters that hurt applicants. Not sure how it will be enforced though.

[Guest]

Northwestern Chair implying they won't be following the guidelines on twitter seemingly.