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How important is innate manual dexterity?
#1
Innate manual dexterity is obviously an advantage in surgical specialties but how big a role does it really play? Are the differences between talented and untalented individuals apparent even after years in practice or can somebody with lacking manual dexterity eventually become a great surgeon with enough motivation?
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#2
Of course it's important. But there aren't nearly enough with innate talent to fulfill the neurosurgical needs of the world. It sounds trite but the best surgeons are made, not born. Med students (and basically everyone else on here) love to fantasize about the "gods" of the field and their technical prowess, but any of them will tell you that what happens in the OR is the easiest part of being a surgeon. 95% of residents CAN be taught to be competent surgeons, as in they have the minimum amount of dexterity required to do the job. But if you can't decide who deserves an operation, what to do if something goes wrong, or how to take care of your patients needs post-op, then your skills in the OR mean jack shit. If you pay even the smallest amount of attention during 7 years of residency, you will learn the basics in the OR. But plenty of shitty residents graduate and go on to make shitty surgeons (including some who fail their boards) because they make terrible decisions or can't communicate with patients or other doctors, not because they can't place screws or take out a tumor.

My 2 cents

- Jr attending
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#3
(12-05-2020, 09:57 PM)Guest Wrote: Of course it's important. But there aren't nearly enough with innate talent to fulfill the neurosurgical needs of the world. It sounds trite but the best surgeons are made, not born. Med students (and basically everyone else on here) love to fantasize about the "gods" of the field and their technical prowess, but any of them will tell you that what happens in the OR is the easiest part of being a surgeon. 95% of residents CAN be taught to be competent surgeons, as in they have the minimum amount of dexterity required to do the job. But if you can't decide who deserves an operation, what to do if something goes wrong, or how to take care of your patients needs post-op, then your skills in the OR mean jack shit. If you pay even the smallest amount of attention during 7 years of residency, you will learn the basics in the OR. But plenty of shitty residents graduate and go on to make shitty surgeons (including some who fail their boards) because they make terrible decisions or can't communicate with patients or other doctors, not because they can't place screws or take out a tumor.

My 2 cents

- Jr attending

agree to some extent but some degree of innate manual dexterity cannot be taught and its absence does factor into some morbidity of complex microsurgical cases. you cannot do a bypass or safely dissect a complex aneurysm without an inherent degree of manual dexterity and it takes a certain degree of humility and self-awareness to admit that you shouldn't be doing these types of cases.
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#4
Spetzler practiced surgical techniques on cadavers on a weekly, if not daily, basis I heard. I remember when I rotated there as a sub-i that the residents got scolded over the fact that he was up there practicing more than them.
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#5
(12-06-2020, 05:35 PM)Focus Wrote: Spetzler practiced surgical techniques on cadavers on a weekly, if not daily, basis I heard. I remember when I rotated there as a sub-i that the residents got scolded over the fact that he was up there practicing more than them.

This is definitely what the greats will say over and over again.  How can PP folks or academic folks without a lab get access to practice like this?
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#6
(12-06-2020, 10:00 PM)Guest Wrote:
(12-06-2020, 05:35 PM)Focus Wrote: Spetzler practiced surgical techniques on cadavers on a weekly, if not daily, basis I heard. I remember when I rotated there as a sub-i that the residents got scolded over the fact that he was up there practicing more than them.

This is definitely what the greats will say over and over again.  How can PP folks or academic folks without a lab get access to practice like this?

There are plenty of lab opportunities from companies looking to train physicians on their equipment. More so in spine than cranial but opportunities are there
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#7
Bump[
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#8
You have to be able to use your hands
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#9
You either have it or you don’t. There are lots of terrible surgeons that make it through every year. Truly gifted surgeons are rare.
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#10
"You either have it or you don’t. There are lots of terrible surgeons that make it through every year. Truly gifted surgeons are rare."

I disagree--slightly--you can improve it, but it is a perishable skill...
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