Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Programs that surprised you
#61
(01-04-2021, 07:42 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 07:12 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 07:00 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 05:57 PM)Guest Wrote: What does a brutal junior residency look like? Just trying to get a sense of what that means compared to my home program

wake up at 4-4:30 AM, not going home until 7-8 PM on average

when home being expected to read for at least 1-2 hours daily re: concepts you did not fully understand during the day

when holding pager expect 10-15 pages per hour on average, 2-3 of which are likely new consults/admissions that you are expected to single-handedly admit/work-up while juggling floor procedures/emergent bedside procedures x 3 to 4 years

when on call, doing the above while juggling the OR with or without your senior resident

Could be even rougher. My intern year I was waking up at 2:45/3

How many miles uphill did you have to walk to get to the hospital?

2 miles uphill each way
Reply
#62
(01-04-2021, 02:07 PM)Guest Wrote: Jefferson isn't a program for everyone. It's similarly busy to other big name academic centers (Pitt in particular comes to mind) but doesn't get the same recognition for whatever reason. You will get good training there but junior residency is brutal. Recent grads have gotten good fellowship positions and academic jobs so it may well be worth it in the end, but it's not going to to be an enjoyable 7 years for sure. It all depends on what you want out of residency

I would say this goes for a good amount of high profile programs, based on my personal experience and friends i still have at these places I would put Jeff, Pitt, Miami, USC, UW, Mt Sinai, UCSF all in that category. I'm sure there's more but those are just some with personal experience or first hand word of mouth, I'd be curious what other programs people would add. These places are high volume, often old school leadership, less hand holding, more yelling, rough work hours during junior residency. 

The trade off is that these places are worth the training they provide. You'll be on the short list for top fellowships/jobs, and you'll be comfortable in the OR with almost any situation after 7 years. The down side, junior residency is tough, you could argue that places like Barrow, Michigan, Columbia, MGH have their graduates getting similar jobs with less headaches. If comfort and lifestyle are high on your priority list, then rank such programs accordingly. I wouldn't classify it as "malignancy" just a different training style/environment.
Reply
#63
(01-04-2021, 08:55 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 02:07 PM)Guest Wrote: Jefferson isn't a program for everyone. It's similarly busy to other big name academic centers (Pitt in particular comes to mind) but doesn't get the same recognition for whatever reason. You will get good training there but junior residency is brutal. Recent grads have gotten good fellowship positions and academic jobs so it may well be worth it in the end, but it's not going to to be an enjoyable 7 years for sure. It all depends on what you want out of residency

I would say this goes for a good amount of high profile programs, based on my personal experience and friends i still have at these places I would put Jeff, Pitt, Miami, USC, UW, Mt Sinai, UCSF all in that category. I'm sure there's more but those are just some with personal experience or first hand word of mouth, I'd be curious what other programs people would add. These places are high volume, often old school leadership, less hand holding, more yelling, rough work hours during junior residency. 

The trade off is that these places are worth the training they provide. You'll be on the short list for top fellowships/jobs, and you'll be comfortable in the OR with almost any situation after 7 years. The down side, junior residency is tough, you could argue that places like Barrow, Michigan, Columbia, MGH have their graduates getting similar jobs with less headaches. If comfort and lifestyle are high on your priority list, then rank such programs accordingly. I wouldn't classify it as "malignancy" just a different training style/environment.

Very well put. Yelling is probably on the spectrum of malignancy, but sometimes we do something dumb enough to warrant it.
Reply
#64
(01-04-2021, 08:39 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 07:42 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 07:12 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 07:00 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 05:57 PM)Guest Wrote: What does a brutal junior residency look like? Just trying to get a sense of what that means compared to my home program

wake up at 4-4:30 AM, not going home until 7-8 PM on average

when home being expected to read for at least 1-2 hours daily re: concepts you did not fully understand during the day

when holding pager expect 10-15 pages per hour on average, 2-3 of which are likely new consults/admissions that you are expected to single-handedly admit/work-up while juggling floor procedures/emergent bedside procedures x 3 to 4 years

when on call, doing the above while juggling the OR with or without your senior resident

Could be even rougher. My intern year I was waking up at 2:45/3

How many miles uphill did you have to walk to get to the hospital?

2 miles uphill each way

This honestly isn't that crazy. I rotated at Pitt and I had my alarm clock set for 3 AM to be in by 3:30 basically every day on service (and so did the other kids who rotated that month).
Reply
#65
(01-04-2021, 10:56 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 08:39 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 07:42 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 07:12 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 07:00 PM)Guest Wrote: wake up at 4-4:30 AM, not going home until 7-8 PM on average

when home being expected to read for at least 1-2 hours daily re: concepts you did not fully understand during the day

when holding pager expect 10-15 pages per hour on average, 2-3 of which are likely new consults/admissions that you are expected to single-handedly admit/work-up while juggling floor procedures/emergent bedside procedures x 3 to 4 years

when on call, doing the above while juggling the OR with or without your senior resident

Could be even rougher. My intern year I was waking up at 2:45/3

How many miles uphill did you have to walk to get to the hospital?

2 miles uphill each way

This honestly isn't that crazy. I rotated at Pitt and I had my alarm clock set for 3 AM to be in by 3:30 basically every day on service (and so did the other kids who rotated that month).

What did you do at 3:30 at subI lol?
Reply
#66
(01-04-2021, 11:51 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 10:56 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 08:39 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 07:42 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 07:12 PM)Guest Wrote: Could be even rougher. My intern year I was waking up at 2:45/3

How many miles uphill did you have to walk to get to the hospital?

2 miles uphill each way

This honestly isn't that crazy. I rotated at Pitt and I had my alarm clock set for 3 AM to be in by 3:30 basically every day on service (and so did the other kids who rotated that month).

What did you do at 3:30 at subI lol?

Dude there are like 50 patients to chart check and see every morning and they're all widely dispersed throughout their hospital.
Reply
#67
(01-04-2021, 11:56 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 11:51 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 10:56 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 08:39 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 07:42 PM)Guest Wrote: How many miles uphill did you have to walk to get to the hospital?

2 miles uphill each way

This honestly isn't that crazy. I rotated at Pitt and I had my alarm clock set for 3 AM to be in by 3:30 basically every day on service (and so did the other kids who rotated that month).

What did you do at 3:30 at subI lol?

Dude there are like 50 patients to chart check and see every morning and they're all widely dispersed throughout their hospital.
You sure rounded on all 50 patients as subI...
Reply
#68
(01-05-2021, 12:00 AM)Guest Wrote: [quote pid='26164' dateline='1609819003']
[quote pid='26163' dateline='1609818704']
This honestly isn't that crazy. I rotated at Pitt and I had my alarm clock set for 3 AM to be in by 3:30 basically every day on service (and so did the other kids who rotated that month).

What did you do at 3:30 at subI lol?

Dude there are like 50 patients to chart check and see every morning and they're all widely dispersed throughout their hospital.
[/quote]
You sure rounded on all 50 patients as subI...
[/quote]

Not sure if you realize this, but as a Sub I you have to show up at or just before the junior residents do, even if you're not responsible for doing every single thing they do. You also have to stand scrubbed for hours during cases, even though you're not the one actually operating.
Reply
#69
(01-04-2021, 07:12 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 07:00 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 05:57 PM)Guest Wrote: What does a brutal junior residency look like? Just trying to get a sense of what that means compared to my home program

wake up at 4-4:30 AM, not going home until 7-8 PM on average

when home being expected to read for at least 1-2 hours daily re: concepts you did not fully understand during the day

when holding pager expect 10-15 pages per hour on average, 2-3 of which are likely new consults/admissions that you are expected to single-handedly admit/work-up while juggling floor procedures/emergent bedside procedures x 3 to 4 years

when on call, doing the above while juggling the OR with or without your senior resident

Could be even rougher. My intern year I was waking up at 2:45/3
Sounds like a ridiculously inefficient service. Investing in midlevel support to handle all the scut so residents can do real work would benefit the resident experience and patients would do better as well. No one is making good clinical decisions leaving at 8 PM only to come back at 2:45 AM 5-6x a week.
Reply
#70
(01-05-2021, 12:33 AM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 07:12 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 07:00 PM)Guest Wrote:
(01-04-2021, 05:57 PM)Guest Wrote: What does a brutal junior residency look like? Just trying to get a sense of what that means compared to my home program

wake up at 4-4:30 AM, not going home until 7-8 PM on average

when home being expected to read for at least 1-2 hours daily re: concepts you did not fully understand during the day

when holding pager expect 10-15 pages per hour on average, 2-3 of which are likely new consults/admissions that you are expected to single-handedly admit/work-up while juggling floor procedures/emergent bedside procedures x 3 to 4 years

when on call, doing the above while juggling the OR with or without your senior resident

Could be even rougher. My intern year I was waking up at 2:45/3
Sounds like a ridiculously inefficient service. Investing in midlevel support to handle all the scut so residents can do real work would benefit the resident experience and patients would do better as well. No one is making good clinical decisions leaving at 8 PM only to come back at 2:45 AM 5-6x a week.

Oh no question. I don't think anyone disagrees with that. That's why most people who rotate at places like that don't rank them #1. I think people are just pointing out that there are a lot of neurosurgery programs still like this with that old school mentality, Jeff and Pitt among them.
Reply


[-]
Quick Reply
Message
Type your reply to this message here.

Image Verification
Please enter the text contained within the image into the text box below it. This process is used to prevent automated spam bots.
Image Verification
(case insensitive)

Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 2 Guest(s)