Residency Explorer/FRIEDA

[Guest]

How reliable are websites like residency explorer or FREIDA in terms of Step 1 scores? Residency explorer says one of the nation's best program like Pitt averages between 236-245. A little wary about these stats on this website.

[Guest]

(04-21-2021, 02:00 PM)Guest Wrote: How reliable are websites like residency explorer or FREIDA in terms of Step 1 scores? Residency explorer says one of the nation's best program like Pitt averages between 236-245. A little wary about these stats on this website.

Wouldn't trust it. NRMP data will show you the ranges for successful and unsuccessful applicants (albeit not program-level), but FREIDA has incomplete data for a lot of the programs and they all seem to fall pretty close together. i think the basic takeaway that you should have for Step 1 is that if you're above 235, you're fine to interviews and everything else is going to determine your success (papers, affability on interviews + sub-I's, strong letters w/ calls to back them up). Also, you should really only care if you're applying this year. Odds are for application cycle 2022-2023 they will only care about step 2 CK score wise because a lot of rising MS3s right now are going to have P/F only. 

If interested more on a program director's input on step 1 scores, take a look at the recent young neurosurgeons video on YouTube w/ JVG from Mayo. His basic takeaway was that they [as a program] are probably going to be looking at scores less and that more broadly programs will be looking to step 2 CK even as soon as this cycle (survey of PDs in this article suggested the same PMID: 32559749)

[Focus]

I have no idea if those webpages are accurate, but I would wager that the average scores of the residents accepted into top programs is much LOWER than the average scores of those interviewed. The reality is that a high step 1 score has traditionally been the easiest way to get your foot in the door, but it is also probably the least predictive factor in terms of a program ranking you to match.

[Guest]

Hmmm not sure that was suggested at all by referenced article. If anything, an overwhelming majority recommended if students had an option to take a scored Step 1, they should. This suggests that they continue to prefer Step 1 over 2. If what you’re saying were true, PDs wouldn’t take a stance on that issue

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(04-21-2021, 03:07 PM)Guest Wrote:

(04-21-2021, 02:00 PM)Guest Wrote: How reliable are websites like residency explorer or FREIDA in terms of Step 1 scores? Residency explorer says one of the nation's best program like Pitt averages between 236-245. A little wary about these stats on this website.

Wouldn't trust it. NRMP data will show you the ranges for successful and unsuccessful applicants (albeit not program-level), but FREIDA has incomplete data for a lot of the programs and they all seem to fall pretty close together. i think the basic takeaway that you should have for Step 1 is that if you're above 235, you're fine to interviews and everything else is going to determine your success (papers, affability on interviews + sub-I's, strong letters w/ calls to back them up). Also, you should really only care if you're applying this year. Odds are for application cycle 2022-2023 they will only care about step 2 CK score wise because a lot of rising MS3s right now are going to have P/F only. 

If interested more on a program director's input on step 1 scores, take a look at the recent young neurosurgeons video on YouTube w/ JVG from Mayo. His basic takeaway was that they [as a program] are probably going to be looking at scores less and that more broadly programs will be looking to step 2 CK even as soon as this cycle (survey of PDs in this article suggested the same PMID: 32559749)

Honestly this is not good advice. Look at the NRMP charting outcomes data for yourself. Of course there are confounding factors involved, but there is a clear strong association between step 1 score and match probability (leveling out around 90+% for 260+). Anecdotally, I know of several PDs at top programs who also have strong preferences for high steps. It is true that the importance of step weans after interview (other factors such as recs, and interpersonal skills take precedence), a 235 will put you in a difficult position to even get you an interview in the first place, barring other mitigating factors such as excellent letters from well known faculty and strong research

[Guest]

(04-23-2021, 04:11 PM)Guest Wrote: Hmmm not sure that was suggested at all by referenced article. If anything, an overwhelming majority recommended if students had an option to take a scored Step 1, they should. This suggests that they continue to prefer Step 1 over 2. If what you’re saying were true, PDs wouldn’t take a stance on that issue

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(04-21-2021, 03:07 PM)Guest Wrote:

(04-21-2021, 02:00 PM)Guest Wrote: How reliable are websites like residency explorer or FREIDA in terms of Step 1 scores? Residency explorer says one of the nation's best program like Pitt averages between 236-245. A little wary about these stats on this website.

Wouldn't trust it. NRMP data will show you the ranges for successful and unsuccessful applicants (albeit not program-level), but FREIDA has incomplete data for a lot of the programs and they all seem to fall pretty close together. i think the basic takeaway that you should have for Step 1 is that if you're above 235, you're fine to interviews and everything else is going to determine your success (papers, affability on interviews + sub-I's, strong letters w/ calls to back them up). Also, you should really only care if you're applying this year. Odds are for application cycle 2022-2023 they will only care about step 2 CK score wise because a lot of rising MS3s right now are going to have P/F only. 

If interested more on a program director's input on step 1 scores, take a look at the recent young neurosurgeons video on YouTube w/ JVG from Mayo. His basic takeaway was that they [as a program] are probably going to be looking at scores less and that more broadly programs will be looking to step 2 CK even as soon as this cycle (survey of PDs in this article suggested the same PMID: 32559749)

Honestly this is not good advice. Look at the NRMP charting outcomes data for yourself. Of course there are confounding factors involved, but there is a clear strong association between step 1 score and match probability (leveling out around 90+% for 260+). Anecdotally, I know of several PDs at top programs who also have strong preferences for high steps. It is true that the importance of step weans after interview (other factors such as recs, and interpersonal skills take precedence), a 235 will put you in a difficult position to even get you an interview in the first place, barring other mitigating factors such as excellent letters from well known faculty and strong research

Agree - I think there is a false premise there is a cohort of MD/PhDs with low steps and amazing pubs. Reality is the top MSTP students in neurosurgery have both high USMLE and CNS pubs. Top programs have their pick, they do not need to compromise.