(10-20-2021, 08:32 PM)Guest Wrote: It has nothing to do with being a FMG and everything to do with making the focus on training Americans First. As long as there are AMG not getting training because FMG are filling spots then the system is broken. Who do you think pays for a FMG to get trained? It’s the US Tax payers that’s who. Also the Fellowship pathway is largely predatory human trafficking. Most have zero chance and the fellowship programs know it. That should be disgusting to you.
By that logic American universities shouldn’t accept international students because they should “focus on training American students first etc”. Tbh I don’t think that neurosurgeons at Mayo or Hopkins or Harvard would accept these graduates if they weren’t good enough. So believe it or not some of these FMGs (around 10 that match every year) are better than some AMGs and that’s all that matters. Ohh and btw there are a couple of international students each year that graduate from US med schools, I’m assuming they shouldn’t match since they don’t pay taxes?
This is a gross display of “foreigners are taking er jobs”. Really expected more from this forum. No complaints of Americans getting educated and trained all around the world. That’s fine to “take up spots” in Israel, Europe, etc.
Neurosurgery should attract the best. Top US med students tend to go into derm, ortho, rads or ophthalmology to it makes sense that some programs hire IMGs.
American graduates who fail to match should be shepherded into family medicine or geriatrics or some specialty where their incompetence/low IQ will lead to the least amount of harm.
(10-20-2021, 03:14 PM)Focus Wrote: (10-20-2021, 01:35 PM)Completely Fucked Wrote: (10-20-2021, 08:50 AM)Guest Wrote: Once again people in this forum are spewing half truths. First off, pre-residency fellowships are not the same as a research fellowship. Former are starting to reappear more, and there are many arguments to be made that they’re a better time investment (irrespective of pubs being the name of the game right now), then crunching through 50 mediocre papers. It’s a very nuanced issue. Many of those IMGs match. Some don’t. How would you know they never match? How would you know who already applied and who didn’t? Many take 2-3 years before their first application due to obvious reasons. I have never seen anyone of those mentoring them be dishonest about the prospects of their pursuit, yet the whole idea of IMGs never matching is simply false. It’s significantly harder, but many of them are the most hard working people out there and they prevail.
The Mayo mill is prominent for taking many IMGs, but they have a good track record with matching them.
You sound like a Mayo mill boss yourself.
I looked up over a dozen such people in neurosurgery. I got their name from the publications and then looked them up on linkined, twitter, researchGate, etc. Literally NONE of the people I looked up ever matched into anything!
I am referring to the research fellowships at Mayo here. I looked some pre-residency NS fellowships (other institutes) and I did see some matched in neurology and rad onc.
ALL of the MAYO people I looked up either went back to their home countries, or continued to be LAB RATS at Mayo or some other top institute.
ALSO ALMOST ALL of the research they did was BS stuff--just retrospective reviews on some obscure outcomes, chart reviews, case studies, etc. I don't see the point in this? Is this just to boost the institution's name?
What is going on at MAYO???
I hear they have a mentorship model.
Do you know the specifics of this? Thank you
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10-22-2021, 05:43 AM
(This post was last modified: 10-22-2021, 05:49 AM by Focus.)
(10-22-2021, 12:40 AM)Guest Wrote: (10-20-2021, 03:14 PM)Focus Wrote: (10-20-2021, 01:35 PM)Completely Fucked Wrote: (10-20-2021, 08:50 AM)Guest Wrote: Once again people in this forum are spewing half truths. First off, pre-residency fellowships are not the same as a research fellowship. Former are starting to reappear more, and there are many arguments to be made that they’re a better time investment (irrespective of pubs being the name of the game right now), then crunching through 50 mediocre papers. It’s a very nuanced issue. Many of those IMGs match. Some don’t. How would you know they never match? How would you know who already applied and who didn’t? Many take 2-3 years before their first application due to obvious reasons. I have never seen anyone of those mentoring them be dishonest about the prospects of their pursuit, yet the whole idea of IMGs never matching is simply false. It’s significantly harder, but many of them are the most hard working people out there and they prevail.
The Mayo mill is prominent for taking many IMGs, but they have a good track record with matching them.
You sound like a Mayo mill boss yourself.
I looked up over a dozen such people in neurosurgery. I got their name from the publications and then looked them up on linkined, twitter, researchGate, etc. Literally NONE of the people I looked up ever matched into anything!
I am referring to the research fellowships at Mayo here. I looked some pre-residency NS fellowships (other institutes) and I did see some matched in neurology and rad onc.
ALL of the MAYO people I looked up either went back to their home countries, or continued to be LAB RATS at Mayo or some other top institute.
ALSO ALMOST ALL of the research they did was BS stuff--just retrospective reviews on some obscure outcomes, chart reviews, case studies, etc. I don't see the point in this? Is this just to boost the institution's name?
What is going on at MAYO???
I hear they have a mentorship model.
Do you know the specifics of this? Thank you
Yes but I was being facetious. It's a pretty common model. Basically you're rounding on and operating on the patients of a specific attending or small number of attendings patients for blocks. Many programs have this structure, all that varies is the number of attendings and how rigidly it is adhered to in terms of case assignments. Usually more common at larger programs and those with multiple hospitals. I had heard that mayo also records residents operating and provides specific feedback based on videos but I don't know how organized this actually is or if they still do it. When I was a resident some of the attendings that I worked with liked to record a lot of their cases and would have me pull specific parts of them for discussion but it wasn't always specifically for technique feedback.
(10-22-2021, 05:43 AM)Focus Wrote: (10-22-2021, 12:40 AM)Guest Wrote: (10-20-2021, 03:14 PM)Focus Wrote: (10-20-2021, 01:35 PM)Completely Fucked Wrote: (10-20-2021, 08:50 AM)Guest Wrote: Once again people in this forum are spewing half truths. First off, pre-residency fellowships are not the same as a research fellowship. Former are starting to reappear more, and there are many arguments to be made that they’re a better time investment (irrespective of pubs being the name of the game right now), then crunching through 50 mediocre papers. It’s a very nuanced issue. Many of those IMGs match. Some don’t. How would you know they never match? How would you know who already applied and who didn’t? Many take 2-3 years before their first application due to obvious reasons. I have never seen anyone of those mentoring them be dishonest about the prospects of their pursuit, yet the whole idea of IMGs never matching is simply false. It’s significantly harder, but many of them are the most hard working people out there and they prevail.
The Mayo mill is prominent for taking many IMGs, but they have a good track record with matching them.
You sound like a Mayo mill boss yourself.
I looked up over a dozen such people in neurosurgery. I got their name from the publications and then looked them up on linkined, twitter, researchGate, etc. Literally NONE of the people I looked up ever matched into anything!
I am referring to the research fellowships at Mayo here. I looked some pre-residency NS fellowships (other institutes) and I did see some matched in neurology and rad onc.
ALL of the MAYO people I looked up either went back to their home countries, or continued to be LAB RATS at Mayo or some other top institute.
ALSO ALMOST ALL of the research they did was BS stuff--just retrospective reviews on some obscure outcomes, chart reviews, case studies, etc. I don't see the point in this? Is this just to boost the institution's name?
What is going on at MAYO???
I hear they have a mentorship model.
Do you know the specifics of this? Thank you
Yes but I was being facetious. It's a pretty common model. Basically you're rounding on and operating on the patients of a specific attending or small number of attendings patients for blocks. Many programs have this structure, all that varies is the number of attendings and how rigidly it is adhered to in terms of case assignments. Usually more common at larger programs and those with multiple hospitals. I had heard that mayo also records residents operating and provides specific feedback based on videos but I don't know how organized this actually is or if they still do it. When I was a resident some of the attendings that I worked with liked to record a lot of their cases and would have me pull specific parts of them for discussion but it wasn't always specifically for technique feedback.
Oh ok thank you for explaining, that sounds very interesting. For some reason I had the impression that it was a unique feature to Mayo. It sounds like a good training program, hope I can match their one day.
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