(02-09-2023, 12:00 PM)Guest Wrote: The ones who leave academia are the r smartest ones. They make 2-3 times as much money, and have easily twice as much free time for themselves and their family. It’s not even a question these days. Academics are a poorly compensated joke, and none of the papers published “push the field forward”. In fact that entire notion is simply an excuse the academics came up with to make themselves feel better about how they’re pushed around shmucks who get $hit on all day long for pennies on the dollar. Get out early, make literally millions of dollars in the community, give urself an amazing luxurious life, and leave ur kids an enormous inheritance. People who stay in academia accomplish none of these things. And at the end of ur life, on ur deathbed, that’s all that matters. An impoverished academics who was an absentee parent won’t have a kid or spouse who’s grateful for his large number of bull$hit papers published. A baller community neurosurgeons kids WILL rremember him fondly for being present in their lives, giving them a great life, and leaving them a lot of money.
^probably the most accurate assessment of academic neurosurgery I’ve read on this website
Did you really just reply to your own post? Pathetic bro.
Lol at the above post. As someone who is in the interview process currently, I think we are seeing the salary gap between academics and the private sector shrinking. As you see reimbursements decreasing you are going to see hospital systems decreasing their dollar per wRVU and thus the private sector is going to get paid less. These hospital systems can't pay you more then you are generating for them and thus reimbursements (and pay in the private sector) are going to go down. On the opposite end of things academic salaries are very slowly but steadily rising and will continue to because with a guarantee base you can only make more every year especially because many of these academic jobs are paid for their contribution to medical student education, research, ect. Plus since the majority of these academic institutions are support by the state their reimbursements aren't as vital to paying salaries ect.
Just my two cents. Would be interested to hear other thoughts.
Is it really true that PP has a better lifestyle?
Also, is it really a good thing to leave max money for your kids? Wouldn't that make them lazy?
Bill gates, Mark Zuckerberg, and Jeff bezos are products of the upper middle class. Depends how you raise your kids.
I think it really depends on the job. There are academic jobs where you're ridiculously underpaid and have a ton of associated BS (high Dean's tax, crazy clinical and research requirements, etc.) and there are some private practice jobs where you have little/no support and are overworked. Conversely, there are plenty of academic jobs where you can run 2 rooms, get paid by RVU, and tons of private jobs where you have minimal/no call and lots of protection with NP/PAs.
In *general*, I think the overall lifestyle is better in private practice because you don't have to do any research projects ever again, no more morning conferences, making random powerpoints/giving talks for free, etc. Think about how many of your nights/weekends go to these things. In private practice, you finish your cases, go home, and don't have to think about work until the next day unless you're on call. Most people I know in private practice have NP/PAs as first call and cover smaller community hospitals with little trauma.
Would you prefer to be a Law Partner and earn 2M a year, or be a Supreme Court Justice and make something like 200k?
Maybe you would prefer to be a Partner, but most lawers dream of becoming a Judge.
(02-11-2023, 12:38 AM)Guest Wrote: Would you prefer to be a Law Partner and earn 2M a year, or be a Supreme Court Justice and make something like 200k?
Maybe you would prefer to be a Partner, but most lawers dream of becoming a Judge.
Very very few people become law partners. Of those that do, most make around 250 grand, basically the salary of a primary care physician. Those that make money in the millions are at the mega law firms where nepotism plays a huge rule.
(02-10-2023, 09:51 PM)Guest Wrote: Bill gates, Mark Zuckerberg, and Jeff bezos are products of the upper middle class. Depends how you raise your kids.
Yup, gotta raise them as white and privileged. Best way to go. Definitely don't raise them Asian unless you want to them face racism and not get awarded for their merit.
Lol at this person continuing to reply to their own messages. If you're optimizing for money, medicine (even neurosurgery) is not the right move.
Breaking it down, neurosurg you make 60-70k for 7 to 9 years of training. Followed by a solid attending starting salary in a normal city would be 700-800k starting. Plus this entails brutal residency training, hierarchical culture, and being on call indefinitely.
Investment banking you can make primary care money (~200k) straught out of college and if you're there for 4 years, you make upwards or 400k plus bonus. If you stay and work your way up the ranks, you're looking at 1-2mil in your mid 30s. However, again, long hours, not great culture, you feel like shit for just making the rich richer.
Consulting you make PCP salary after business school and if you stay 7-9 years (same as neurosurgery training), you can make upwards of 2mil as a partner. Again, lifestyle isn't incredible (60hrs a week, lots of travel, etc) but any lifestyle is an upgrade from neurosurgery.
And this doesn't even include how much you can make from a successful startup, VC, etc.
Basically, one does medicine (and neurosurgery) because it's a straightforward, "low risk", high job satisfaction, and prestigious profession - not for the money.
The things mentioned above are correct, however, there are a lot of "ifs" involved in this. Not everyone makes partner, not everyone stays in investment banking, not everyone can land a job in VC or consulting. There are too many variables at play in those other professions. In neurosurgery, if you work hard enough for 7 years, you are GUARANTEED to make ~1 million for the rest of your life regardless of other outside variables. In corporate America, it's not about how hard you work, it's about your networking skills and politics. Unfortunately, those two things cannot be controlled for. If you show up to work everyday in neurosurgery, and can get through the 7 years, you have become a millionaire.
There are "ifs" that people overlook in neurosurgery too, though. There's no guarantee you match, to begin with. There's no guarantee you don't have a shitty senior or attending that wants you fired in residency. There's no guarantee that you don't have an accident and can't use your hands. Plus, most of all, there's no guarantee that in this macroeconomic environment, neurosurgeon salaries won't continue to decrease (which has been the reimbursement pattern for the greater part of a decade)
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