Attrition Rate In Neurosurgery

[Guest]

Is any other medical student concerned about the attrition rate in neurosurgery? Yes I love neurosurgery but ultimately I would like to be able to finish residency otherwise my degree will be an expensive piece of worthless paper. Going through this website has me really concerned about the number of residents that get fired even as seniors. Why is the attrition in this specialty higher than other surgical specialties like ortho or Gen surg?

[Guest]

I want to remind you of a few things about this attrition rate:

1. Programs don't single out their strong residents and pick on them hoping they quit
2. It is in everyone (program and resident) best interest for the resident to succeed. When you match, the program isn't plotting against you
3. Attrition rate also captures people that decide to leave on their own accord for another field seeking a better life style. This is the case for the 3 people I knew in my junior years. In each case they already had a spouse and kids and they simply wanted to be at home more which is great. They didn't leave neurosurgery due to a toxic culture
4. It is actually hard to fire a resident. It requires a long paper trail across months/years showing unprofessional or unethical behavior. If your a jerk to work with they will look harder to find examples of this behavior. But if you show up, do your best, and are a normal human being, no one is targetting you
5. This website's stories on attrition are from anonymous posters. For all you now its from an internet troll not even in medicine, or maybe it is from a former resident holding a grudge. It doesn't matter, its not you. Although I am happy to see my time in residency almost over, I can say I have had an amazing experience. I am close with my co-residents, I have great relationships with my attendings and have found mentors/friends for life.

TLDR: If you like the field of neurosurgery do not be dissuaded by the anonymous posters on this forum spewing toxicity. Its a great field full of fun and amazing people. I wouldn't have chosen anything else and would do it again in a second.

[Guest]

(05-17-2021, 09:44 AM)Guest Wrote: I want to remind you of a few things about this attrition rate:

1. Programs don't single out their strong residents and pick on them hoping they quit
2. It is in everyone (program and resident) best interest for the resident to succeed. When you match, the program isn't plotting against you
3. Attrition rate also captures people that decide to leave on their own accord for another field seeking a better life style. This is the case for the 3 people I knew in my junior years. In each case they already had a spouse and kids and they simply wanted to be at home more which is great. They didn't leave neurosurgery due to a toxic culture
4. It is actually hard to fire a resident. It requires a long paper trail across months/years showing unprofessional or unethical behavior. If your a jerk to work with they will look harder to find examples of this behavior. But if you show up, do your best, and are a normal human being, no one is targetting you
5. This website's stories on attrition are from anonymous posters. For all you now its from an internet troll not even in medicine, or maybe it is from a former resident holding a grudge. It doesn't matter, its not you. Although I am happy to see my time in residency almost over, I can say I have had an amazing experience. I am close with my co-residents, I have great relationships with my attendings and have found mentors/friends for life.

TLDR: If you like the field of neurosurgery do not be dissuaded by the anonymous posters on this forum spewing toxicity. Its a great field full of fun and amazing people. I wouldn't have chosen anything else and would do it again in a second.

Great post

[Guest]

This is not entirely true. I know of a program director who keeps half his residents on probation to maintain control.

[Guest]

(05-17-2021, 05:18 PM)Guest Wrote: This is not entirely true. I know of a program director who keeps half his residents on probation to maintain control.

Wow, half? You must be joking.

[Guest]

Really? Where? Names...

[Guest]

(05-17-2021, 05:18 PM)Guest Wrote: This is not entirely true. I know of a program director who keeps half his residents on probation to maintain control.

I find it hard to believe that there is a program direct that keeps half of the entire resident group (like what 5-10 people?) on probation... That person would likely not stay PD for long. Things like this reach the ACGME. Keeping half of the residency on probation would also attract the attention within the same institution outside of the neurosurgery department. There are governing bodies that oversee issues like this. 

So this sounds like another example of an anonymous internet poster saying 'well I heard this bad stuff happens' without any type of qualifying information. Not saying there isn't a residency out there with a couple residents on probation right now, but I can't possibly imagine half of the residency...

[Guest]

Yeah, I call bullshit but there are some real motherfuckers in neurosurgery so it’s possible.

[Guest]

Neurosurgery attracts a lot of evil people. For example the governing board purposefully maintains a critical shortage of surgeons to increase salary. Very unethical

[Guest]

(05-18-2021, 06:34 AM)Guest Wrote: Neurosurgery attracts a lot of evil people. For example the governing board purposefully maintains a critical shortage of surgeons to increase salary. Very unethical

Almost every competitive specialty/sub-specialty does this. If this is an example of NSGY attracting evil ppl, then Urology, ENT, derm, optho, ortho, IR, and Cards must attract evil ppl too.