Programs in this cycle

[Guest]

(05-19-2020, 05:31 PM)Guest Wrote: What are the best academic programs that don't sacrifice operative experience? We always hear about UCSF/Mayo/UW, but where would be the next steps after those?

UCLA, Duke, WashU, UVA

[Guest]

(05-19-2020, 05:34 PM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 05:31 PM)Guest Wrote: What are the best academic programs that don't sacrifice operative experience? We always hear about UCSF/Mayo/UW, but where would be the next steps after those?

UCLA, Duke, WashU, UVA

I don't think that you can in good conscience say that you're not sacrificing operative experience (at these otherwise excellent) programs. I'd keep Wash U and add USC, Miami, Pitt, and Emory. You might be sacrificing lifestyle/sanity at some of these but they're powerhouse operative places whose graduates can get academic jobs.

[Guest]

(05-19-2020, 06:00 PM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 05:34 PM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 05:31 PM)Guest Wrote: What are the best academic programs that don't sacrifice operative experience? We always hear about UCSF/Mayo/UW, but where would be the next steps after those?

UCLA, Duke, WashU, UVA

I don't think that you can in good conscience say that you're not sacrificing operative experience (at these otherwise excellent) programs. I'd keep Wash U and add USC, Miami, Pitt, and Emory. You might be sacrificing lifestyle/sanity at some of these but they're powerhouse operative places whose graduates can get academic jobs.

Would NYU not fall in with these?

[Guest]

(05-19-2020, 06:17 PM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 06:00 PM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 05:34 PM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 05:31 PM)Guest Wrote: What are the best academic programs that don't sacrifice operative experience? We always hear about UCSF/Mayo/UW, but where would be the next steps after those?

UCLA, Duke, WashU, UVA

I don't think that you can in good conscience say that you're not sacrificing operative experience (at these otherwise excellent) programs. I'd keep Wash U and add USC, Miami, Pitt, and Emory. You might be sacrificing lifestyle/sanity at some of these but they're powerhouse operative places whose graduates can get academic jobs.

Would NYU not fall in with these?

Very polarized opinions. Compared to other programs in NYC it has a decent operative experience (mostly because of the autonomous year at Bellevue). Some people love it. Some (especially outside New York) who rotated or second looked there really didn't like it and said the autonomy is pretty bad PGY1-5 and that Bellevue doesn't have a lot of complex non-trauma cases.

[Guest]

(05-19-2020, 06:27 PM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 06:17 PM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 06:00 PM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 05:34 PM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 05:31 PM)Guest Wrote: What are the best academic programs that don't sacrifice operative experience? We always hear about UCSF/Mayo/UW, but where would be the next steps after those?

UCLA, Duke, WashU, UVA

I don't think that you can in good conscience say that you're not sacrificing operative experience (at these otherwise excellent) programs. I'd keep Wash U and add USC, Miami, Pitt, and Emory. You might be sacrificing lifestyle/sanity at some of these but they're powerhouse operative places whose graduates can get academic jobs.

Would NYU not fall in with these?

Very polarized opinions. Compared to other programs in NYC it has a decent operative experience (mostly because of the autonomous year at Bellevue). Some people love it. Some (especially outside New York) who rotated or second looked there really didn't like it and said the autonomy is pretty bad PGY1-5 and that Bellevue doesn't have a lot of complex non-trauma cases.

Sub-I'd at NYU this past cycle. Would agree that NYU has the best operative experience of the NYC programs (apart from LIJ) but even then its significantly less than west coast programs (BNI, UW, USC, etc.) and some east coast programs such as Pitt. At Kimmel the residents primarily open and close for PGY1-6 for cranial cases and many large spine whacks apart from some simpler spine cases. Bellevue is the county hospital experience and only really has autonomy during chief year. most cases are trauma with some open vascular, skullbase, etc. scattered throughout. NYC is a unique place to do surgical training as a result of these factors. NYU is a great program dont get me wrong but definitely not comparable to others. If anyone can comment on comparisons with Pitt, USC, UW, Mayo, BNI, etc., that may help other med students as well.

[Guest]

(05-19-2020, 06:27 PM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 06:17 PM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 06:00 PM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 05:34 PM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 05:31 PM)Guest Wrote: What are the best academic programs that don't sacrifice operative experience? We always hear about UCSF/Mayo/UW, but where would be the next steps after those?

UCLA, Duke, WashU, UVA

I don't think that you can in good conscience say that you're not sacrificing operative experience (at these otherwise excellent) programs. I'd keep Wash U and add USC, Miami, Pitt, and Emory. You might be sacrificing lifestyle/sanity at some of these but they're powerhouse operative places whose graduates can get academic jobs.

Would NYU not fall in with these?

Very polarized opinions. Compared to other programs in NYC it has a decent operative experience (mostly because of the autonomous year at Bellevue). Some people love it. Some (especially outside New York) who rotated or second looked there really didn't like it and said the autonomy is pretty bad PGY1-5 and that Bellevue doesn't have a lot of complex non-trauma cases.

Got it. Thank you!

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(05-19-2020, 05:31 PM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 04:58 PM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 04:49 PM)Guest Wrote: How is Iowa a lesser known place?

My point in the post above exactly. It's not a lesser known place, but this site can make you feel like you did something wrong by matching there.

I couldn’t agree more. I matched at Columbia a couple years back, and was thrilled as it was my dream program. Then I got on this site, and the perpetual bashing of it - and programs “like” it - really made me second guess myself for a bit. You have to know what you want and go for it. Happiness is so valuable.

As someone who is actually at that program, how do you feel about your operative experience? Was it something you valued when you applied? How has it lived up to your expectations?

[Guest]

(05-19-2020, 12:27 AM)Guest Wrote: Can any residents and/or previous rotators talk about the differences between Pitt, USC, BNI, and UW? (i.e. case volume,  academic opportunities available, lifestyle, culture, etc.)

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(05-19-2020, 12:27 AM)Guest Wrote: Can any residents and/or previous rotators talk about the differences between Pitt, USC, BNI, and UW? (i.e. case volume,  academic opportunities available, lifestyle, culture, etc.)

Bump ^^

Bump ^^^

[Guest]

(05-20-2020, 12:49 AM)And Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 12:27 AM)Guest Wrote: Can any residents and/or previous rotators talk about the differences between Pitt, USC, BNI, and UW? (i.e. case volume,  academic opportunities available, lifestyle, culture, etc.)

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(05-19-2020, 12:27 AM)Guest Wrote: Can any residents and/or previous rotators talk about the differences between Pitt, USC, BNI, and UW? (i.e. case volume,  academic opportunities available, lifestyle, culture, etc.)

Bump ^^

Bump ^^^

Bro you're persistent. You can find all this info if you just search this site. 

All three of these programs are operatively heavy, perhaps the highest case volumes in the country. (You can add Mayo and UCSF to that list too)

Pitt/UW - arguably twin programs on opposite coasts. Also very strong academic programs. Lifestyle and culture are better than in the past, but still very intense and you will be worked hard. 

USC - less research opportunities than the above, but incredible (borderline scary) autonomy.

BNI - Not an academic program whatsoever. But what Barrow lacks in academics, it makes up in culture and lifestyle. 

At the end of the day, all of the residents at these programs are proud to be at their respective institutions and work very hard. Excellent places to train. 

But like a precious poster mentioned, everyone asks about these places - try to find programs which are a good fit for you, not just programs that people seem to rave about.

[Guest]

(05-20-2020, 12:49 AM)Guest Wrote:

(05-19-2020, 12:27 AM)Guest Wrote: Can any residents and/or previous rotators talk about the differences between Pitt, USC, BNI, and UW? (i.e. case volume,  academic opportunities available, lifestyle, culture, etc.)

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(05-19-2020, 12:27 AM)Guest Wrote: Can any residents and/or previous rotators talk about the differences between Pitt, USC, BNI, and UW? (i.e. case volume,  academic opportunities available, lifestyle, culture, etc.)

Bump ^^

Bump ^^^

Depends on which of these categories you want to max out. Overall, Barrow wins and it's not even close.

BNI: ~7,000 cases+ /year with incredible complexity. Amazing lifestyle. Juniors take in house call Q4 but always get post-call days and after that, seniors routinely leave by 5-6 PM. Culture is incredible. Virtually no yelling, manipulation, or abuse of any kind. Residents are all super chill and hang out together. Tons of money/resources to take care of all your scut. You show up, quickly run past your ICU patients, go do your cases autonomously, and leave at 5 PM to go hang out with your family or a resident pool party. Can do as much or as little research as you want, but there are basic opportunities if you want (even in tumor with guys like Sanai). Internal $80,000 grants given out to residents like candy.

UW: High volume. Don't know exact number of cases. Juniors get slammed at Harborview (think like 15+ admissions each night) but seniors have a decent lifestyle (maybe out by 7:30?) More formal academic environment but overall the faculty really care about the residents' success. I personally liked the residents: good mix of broey and nice/nerdy. Best basic science research among those 4 and it's not even close. Much harder for residents to find the time to do hard core basic outside of research year due to call. 

Pitt: Insanely high volume, also over 7,000 cases (maybe even slightly higher than Barrow?) Some amazing researchers but basic science is hard to do given the clinical work. By far the busiest program of them all. Trauma junior gets in by 3 AM and stays until 10:30 PM routinely. Warzone ER. Lifestyle doesn't really improve as you progress - virtually no NP/PA support. Some great attendings, some much tougher ones who are hard on the residents. Residents are a good group but are clearly beat down by the experience. A decent amount seemed unhappy during my Sub-I but they come out incredibly well trained.

USC: Essentially Pitt (but lower volume) and with a cohesive group of residents. Incredible autonomy at County. No post-call days (residents work true 36 hour shifts) but are overall happy due to good culture. Nice attendings - overall the residents are treated well. Internal R25 for research experience. Can take protected research year for projects or can enfold a fellowship (not CAST since before chief year).

[Guest]

There’s been a lot of talk about autonomy vs. research exposure vs. volume, but what about mentorship/teaching? What good is a program with insane volume, when as a junior resident the attending doesn’t teach/pimp you in the OR or lectures/conferences are nonexistent/noninformative? I’m most curious to know which programs have outstanding attendings that have resident education as their #1 priority. It has always bugged me that one of the pinnacles of prestige in the field is to become a “Professor of Neurosurgery,” but so many that obtain this title could give 2 sh*ts about the essence of professorship: teaching. USC might have tremendous volume and autonomy, but do Zada and Mack and Giannotta constantly strive to teach residents? Conversely, BWH may have less volume, but are the cases that residents do scrub filled with teaching by Bi, Cosgrove, and Almefty?