(02-14-2018, 05:56 PM)Guest Wrote: (02-13-2018, 07:52 PM)Guest Wrote: (02-13-2018, 03:48 PM)Guest Wrote: (02-13-2018, 02:19 PM)Guest Wrote: AOA is the biggest sham and lie - if you are white, rich, and well connected you already win the game.
Minorities should work together to share resources, mentor other minorities and students that are underrepresented in medicine.
And as a field, we as neurosurgeons should not think AOA means academic merit as much as it means class, wealth, and whiteness.
"After controlling for US Medical Licensing Examination Step 1 scores, research productivity, community service, leadership activity, and Gold Humanism membership, the study found that black (adjusted odds ratio [aOR], 0.16; 95% CI, 0.07-0.37) and Asian (aOR, 0.52; 95% CI, 0.42-0.65) medical students remained less likely to be AΩA members than white medical students. " From the JAMA article
Way to not control for GRADES, the number one criteria for AOA. lol
Way to not understand basic principles of study design.
Nice trolling. You can't even explain how grades shouldn't be factored in, when grades are the most important selection criteria.
You don't want to control for causal factors since this biases towards the null.
(02-15-2018, 02:49 PM)Guest Wrote: (02-14-2018, 05:56 PM)Guest Wrote: (02-13-2018, 07:52 PM)Guest Wrote: (02-13-2018, 03:48 PM)Guest Wrote: (02-13-2018, 02:19 PM)Guest Wrote: AOA is the biggest sham and lie - if you are white, rich, and well connected you already win the game.
Minorities should work together to share resources, mentor other minorities and students that are underrepresented in medicine.
And as a field, we as neurosurgeons should not think AOA means academic merit as much as it means class, wealth, and whiteness.
"After controlling for US Medical Licensing Examination Step 1 scores, research productivity, community service, leadership activity, and Gold Humanism membership, the study found that black (adjusted odds ratio [aOR], 0.16; 95% CI, 0.07-0.37) and Asian (aOR, 0.52; 95% CI, 0.42-0.65) medical students remained less likely to be AΩA members than white medical students. " From the JAMA article
Way to not control for GRADES, the number one criteria for AOA. lol
Way to not understand basic principles of study design.
Nice trolling. You can't even explain how grades shouldn't be factored in, when grades are the most important selection criteria.
You don't want to control for causal factors since this biases towards the null.
Oh right they shouldn't have controlled for step 1, research productivity, community service, and leadership. Good point.
Not if those things are prone to racial bias and are determinants of AOA membership.
You want to control for other markers of success in medical school that are ostensibly race-blind. You don't want to control for factors that may be part of the causal chain because this biases towards the null.
Please explain how the standardized STEP1 exam or the standardized shelf exams are racially biased.
(02-15-2018, 06:56 PM)Guest Wrote: Not if those things are prone to racial bias and are determinants of AOA membership.
You want to control for other markers of success in medical school that are ostensibly race-blind. You don't want to control for factors that may be part of the causal chain because this biases towards the null.
Oh right I forgot that the first question they ask on Step 1 and all graded tests in med school is "what is your race".
Again, nice trolling.
I think you could make an argument that clinical grades are at least race-blind if they are determined by shelf scores. But if they are determined by clinical evaluations and those evaluations are not race-blind, then you would not want to control for clinical grades in evaluating the association between race and AOA membership.
(02-18-2018, 09:07 PM)Guest Wrote: I think you could make an argument that clinical grades are at least race-blind if they are determined by shelf scores. But if they are determined by clinical evaluations and those evaluations are not race-blind, then you would not want to control for clinical grades in evaluating the association between race and AOA membership.
Fair enough. Somewhere like Missouri (based on recent news) that could definitely be a factor. At other institutions being an underrepresented minority would probably keep you from getting BAD evals (you can always claim discrimination). At my med school shelf is the most important.
But does it really matter THAT much?
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